The Power of Joy

Paula: [00:00:00] Welcome everyone to another episode of Chatting with the Experts with me, the host Paula Okonneh. Every week I bring to you women, amazing women I have to add, from Africa and the Caribbean and in the diaspora, who share with you things that at the end [00:01:00] of the show you would have learnt. You would have been inspired, or be encouraged by these women. Today, the title of my show is An Ordinary Life Filled With the Extraordinary. My guest is… I have to tell you about her. First of all, she’s extra special to me because she’s my aunt. So my guest’s name is Judith Bullen, and she’s going to be talking about an ordinary life filled with extraordinary people who in turn success, failure, and search for meaning, with a growing sense of gratitude.
She’s my aunt. So I’ll tell you a little bit about her and she may tell you more. She’s Jamaican born, but is now an American citizen. And she is retired and lives [00:02:00] in Ocala. There she shares her passion for gardening, for painting, for jewelry making, and for writing. And that brings her joy, not just her, but she also shares the joy with others. She’s active in her church and she enjoys family interaction and marvels at how many seasons of growth life offers to us as she listens to new calls on how to serve others. She’s had an amazing life. She’s worked as the secretary general of the Grenada National Commission for UNESCO and prior to that she served for two years as the OAS project’s Coordinator. So she was a coordinator for the National In Service Teacher Training Program. Prior to that, she was a high school Spanish teacher, and now she’s the author [00:03:00] of a book. So with that, I want to welcome my aunt, Judith Bullen, to Chatting with the Experts. Hello, Aunt Judith!
Aunty Judith: Hello, Paula.
Paula: I’m so happy that you are my guest. I feel extra special.
Aunty Judith: Thank you.
Paula: Extra special. So I tried to talk a bit about you, but is there anything I left out? Because you have an amazing bio, auntie. I don’t know where to end, where to start. I mean, you’re just so good.
Aunty Judith: Well, you left out Jamaica and you left out Boston, but that’s all in the past. If you don’t mind, I’d like to focus more on the present and on the book, Hiding, Thinking, Being, and Present Joys, because, you know, living in the past is, old people tend to [00:04:00] do that. And I think we need to learn that the present is so much more important. That’s how we relate to our generation and future generations by being mindful of what’s going on now.
Paula: Absolutely. And before we talk about the book, I have to show you a book. I am so proud. I read this book from front to back, and I enjoyed every part of it. So, sorry auntie, I interrupted you.
Aunty Judith: No, you didn’t. My son Robert, your cousin, read the book and he’s a computer programmer, systems manager, and he struggled with the fact that the title was not reflected in the order of the presentation. Kind of challenged me, so how come it wasn’t arranged in Hiding, thinking, being. And we had a little discussion, but [00:05:00] that made me go back to the author of that phrase who is Bishop Spong. He’s an Episcopalian Bishop, and I went back to his book actually, his book, and you, I don’t know if you can see it.
Paula: You have to hold it up a bit.
Aunty Judith: Oh, okay.
Paula: Oh, no. Okay. You’re going, it’s going in and out.
Aunty Judith: You know, it’s called Eternal Life, a New Vision. His name is John Shelby Spong. I was so inspired by that phrase, but when I delved back in the book, there is so much there. And if you don’t mind, I’d like to share a little of it. Is that good?
Paula: That’s fine.
Aunty Judith: Okay. So, he says, God is the ground of all being. God is not an old white man in the sky, but so much more than that. And our [00:06:00] journey is a journey inwards to find meaning. And as an answer to Robert’s question, a lot of the questions are journeying in order to find meaning. Bishop Spong says the past, the present, and the future do not have boundaries. Just think about that for a minute. We kind of live in a undifferentiated time. The more deeply I am able to love, the more God becomes part of me. And he also said, Jesus was a human life so deeply lived. A human life through which love flowed without barrier or interception, a being so courageously present that he was open to the ultimate ground of all being. He became one with God [00:07:00] and a lot of my poems are just a conversation with God about stuff and so I’ll share some poems if you wish.
Paula: I would love you to because there’s some that stood out for me, but let’s go with what you know stood out for you, what you want to share and then we can.
Aunty Judith: Yes. Well, We can go back to my life and my ups and downs, but the point that I wanted to share first is Jesus redefined life and death.
Paula: I like that one.
Aunty Judith: Page 24. Jesus redefined life and death. Lord Jesus. You were a carpenter’s son who symbolically cleansed the temple, sullied by co optation, hypocrisy, and greed. One of hundreds crucified by Roman hegemony, that savage, shaming penalty [00:08:00] imposed in the name of law and order. An idol you despised and confronted knowing the cost. You left us no selfies, Lord, except the Gospels, memorialized reflections, multifaceted images of the intensity within your lived life, with not enough words to fully express fire of fearlessness, the joy of purpose, the irrational compassion and love and insight with which you touched others.
You trumped tribal myths of a warring messiah with an internal transformative revolution. You were in God and God was in you. The kingdom of God broke through. [00:09:00] Your disciples who scattered and fled to save their lives who denied you and went back to old routines were sparked individually into an explosion of insight of new words of boldness fearlessness of love that came to define them living that proclaimed a new life in the word dying with joy knowing Jesus not Caesar as Lord. We, too, are carpenters sons and daughters, pursuing varying degrees of privileged living today. We, too, see the savagery of social injustice and deprivation masquerading as in Caesar’s day, as law and order. Inspire us to despise [00:10:00] and topple such idols in ourselves to grasp the intensity within your lived life, the fire of fearlessness and joy of purpose, the irrational compassion and love and insight with which you touched others.
We will speak new words of fearlessness and love. We will live a new life in the word and die with joy. May we. Like your disciples in the arena shout Jesus is Lord as our lives echo. Amen. So, you know, I was trying to think of how charismatic, how, you know, overpowering Jesus personality must have been that people listen to him and they still didn’t understand him and it was only afterwards that many of [00:11:00] the disciples came to understand. So, there’s another one called Reformed Theology.
Paula: What page is that, Auntie?
Aunty Judith: This side. You want me to read it?
Paula: What page is that?
Aunty Judith: You know, I will read poems all the time. If you let me.
Paula: Well, as you’re looking for it, the other thing, I love this one that you chose, Jesus Redefined Life and Death, because another poem that stood out for me is Branding Jesus.
Aunty Judith: Ah, yes.
Paula: I love that one too, because I love how you took modern day where, we brand everything and you brought it down to, different perspectives, how people look at Jesus. Like the first one you said, Jesus, the first stanza, Jesus, Yeshua, false [00:12:00] prophet, many injury. Jesus, my Lord, my way, exclusively, conservative Christians. Jesus, perfect and prude, hater of those we dislike, more conservative Christians. Jesus, avenging judge, here now and coming again, militant Christians. So, who is Jesus to me? And then you gave your own view on that. Jesus, son of Mary, Yeshua, a Jewish. Prophet, not conformed but transforming, servant, Lord, way maker and guide, ever pointing beyond the familiar to an all encompassing kingdom, Jesus, Son of God, my guide to be open to the least and the lost, women, prostitutes, children, lepers, and lunatics, who did not condemn the woman taken in, adultery, my hope for a way to live more abundantly, my faith and life eternal, [00:13:00] through God’s Grace. Jesus. Oh, Jesus. I love that one too.
Aunty Judith: Thank you. Well, you know, you and I share a strong faith and Spong has challenged some of the notions that we had. Like the notion, one thing the scholars point out is that In the Jesus age, people understood metaphor more than we do now, so a lot of what was said was metaphor, and we have insisted on taking it literally. And Spong asks us, Do you really believe that heaven exists as a place with milk and honey? Do you really believe that hell is a place with [00:14:00] fire burning? Or is this a metaphor? Because some people who live in hell, it’s as if they are living with fire burning all the time. If you think of it, some people who are very unhappy in their lives, it’s like living with a fire burning and you’re not having any water. It could well be a metaphor, but he goes beyond questions. He does provide us some answers.
So I recommend that book. And I read Reformed Theology, my take. I’m now in the Presbyterian denomination and the Presbyterians consider themselves thinking, reforming denomination. Reformed and always reforming is their motto. So they’re always willing to [00:15:00] rethink. Reformed theology, my take. Reformed theology, my take.
Paula: Okay.
Aunty Judith: God, you created the ever expanding universe. You spoke my spinning planet into harmony. Oh, holy God, you encompass eternity. You’re far above and beyond the scope of my comprehension, yet you fill my reality with the intimacy of love. We are children of Adam and Eve, unworthy sinners. Self serving, self centered, fearful, lazy, and so often faithless. We rush headlong and are unwilling to stop and be still and know that you are God. Jesus came to teach, to reveal that grace is free. [00:16:00] He was ever willing to heal by touching the blind, even lepers. He ate with sinners, he offered himself freely to all, like common bread and wine. He taught and retaught that my kingdom is not of this world. Yet when sin, Rome, and threatened church leaders conspired to kill him as a criminal terrorist, though innocent, he went silently to the shameful cross.
At what cost? That silence. Then a resurrection was created by God in Peter, before so easily called by a maid to deny Jesus, now boldly speaking to crowds about his good news. For Jesus open life and willing death had become a mighty voice from heaven, [00:17:00] insisting grace is free. Even his blind disciples could now see. What then is my response today? The liberating joy of the Lord can strengthen me. In the midst of circumstances, I can know that I am not alone. That I cannot hide from God’s love. I can be bold and pray for the impossible, for named loved ones facing disease. God heals. I can work daily and ignite routines with a spark of the grace received. God’s Holy Spirit creates still. Agape love prompts me to lay aside self and focus on another’s life, sustained by the energy and beauty and presence of God. Yeah, [00:18:00] so, you know, sometimes we’re tempted to say what our faith journey is. This was an attempt to say what my beliefs are.
Paula: This is very powerful.
Aunty Judith: Thank you.
Paula: Very powerful. You said an attempt. I don’t think this is an attempt. This is you.
Aunty Judith: This is me.
Paula: Yes. And I noticed that it was previously published in Ghibli.
Aunty Judith: Yes. The first book, I have that book. Jimbilins are the Jamaican, is the Jamaican, whatever, Jimbilin is the Jamaican name for a fruit that in Grenada you’d call gooseberry, I think.
Paula: Okay, I know it.
Aunty Judith: It’s a very tart fruit.
Paula: Very tart, yes.
Aunty Judith: Yes, yes, just thinking about it makes your tongue.
Paula: Already squeezing up my face.
Aunty Judith: Yeah. So, no, not all the poems are, trying to be so profound. I went to Jamaica last year [00:19:00] and our cousins came to meet us at the beach and we sat down, we chatted, we ate together. Of course, you know, Jamaicans like ackee and salt fish and rice and peas and we ate lunch together. They were talking about just the family. A disease in Jamaica that it’s like the flu. It’s called chikungunya. .
Paula: Yes, yes. It was around. It’s been around for some time.
Aunty Judith: Been around. Yes. So they were talking about that. So I wrote it all into a poem.
Paula: Where’s that poem Aunt Judith?
Aunty Judith: It’s on page 86.
Paula: 86. Okay.
Aunty Judith: Yes. It’s called Mango Joy. Oh, I forgot to mention the most important thing. They have mango trees at home and they brought a bag, a huge bag of mangoes for us. And that was like coming home. [00:20:00] The mango that it’s the nicest. It’s the East Indian mango. It’s kidney shaped. It’s big. It’s juicy. It’s hairy, so the hairs will stick up in your teeth. Another half an hour. Taking it out. But it’s pure joy to eat. So, this is called mango joy. What a way, East Indian mango sweet. Not to mention juicy. This July. Oh my, I mean, I peel the skin with my teeth. Lovely flesh glows. Then my lips meet the hairiness. The juice flows down my cheek and down my arms. It even drops into my lap. This is Mango Joy Fitzshrew. So, our dear, dear cousins came. We had a lovely day in the sea. We chatted [00:21:00] about many things. Life, children, grandchildren, chikungunya and Aki. Then they showed us the bag. Mango Joy! Mango Joy fitzshrew!
Paula: I read that and I could feel the joy that you felt in a whole big bag of mangoes, because we don’t get the same type of mangoes now we live in the United States. Not at all. Where, it’s just fresh and you sink your teeth into it.
Aunty Judith: Juicy.
Paula: Juicy. Yes. And that, so it was on your vacation there that you well, you are recording your experience on vacation and your cousins visited with these mangoes.
Aunty Judith: Yes. But you know, the vacation wasn’t [00:22:00] totally joyful because I don’t know if you have experienced this, but going back home, not sure where you call home. Is it Grenada?
Paula: I call… I go to Grenada more often than I go to Nigeria. So Grenada is more home because I think my, the last few years of my parents lives were in Grenada.
Aunty Judith: Were in Grenada, yes. So, but when you go, you look for friends that were there and they’re not there often in the States.
Paula: Yes.
Aunty Judith: You look for places and they have changed. Going back home, it’s hard to find home when you do back. And this poem called Land of My Birds. On page 77. It’s sort of a bittersweet thing. I was impressed by… we were on the beach at the hotel and you know the liveliness of people that are [00:23:00] there and the music. You always have music when you’re in the Caribbean. I mean, it’s non stop.
Paula: Non stop, whether you want to hear it or not.
Aunty Judith: True.
Paula: Share it with you very loudly too.
Aunty Judith: Exactly. And then some people, of course, tourists mainly, will be searching for marijuana and all the thrills associated with visiting the Caribbean. So, now and again, you do get a whiff of the marijuana, which they call collyweed in Jamaica.
Paula: Ah, that’s what it is.
Aunty Judith: Which smells really bad to me. It smells like a skunk. That’s why I describe it. So this one is called Land of My Birth. Land of my birth, where do you hide? Beyond the leaf swirled azure tide, Up in the cloud screened sunset’s pride, Barred by the steps, weak knees must stride.
Paula: Oh, I relate to that. [00:24:00] Weak knees for me.
Aunty Judith: There you go. Jamaica love within my heart, bound up with souls so long depart, meshed in the places filled by dust, tangled reminders that shine through rust. Mixed in with laughter of children I hear, The music syncopate with patois claire. See black skin beauty clad in sea gear. Love binds my alien soul to kinetic patria dare. Hustle and strive is everywhere. Joy fills my eyes, blots out a tear. Skunk like collyweed fills the air. Silently, my friend Doggie, who jumped to his death when high, seems to give me a stare, and I look away and pray. That is a story, [00:25:00] true story, a friend of mine. He had mental issues, I believe, but he did jump off something really high when he was high with marijuana, which makes me know that marijuana is not a harmless drug, as people say.
Paula: Yes. And, you come in, you being Jamaican born, Jamaican native would know that.
Aunty Judith: Exactly.
Paula: Even more so than others.
Aunty Judith: This, it needs to be taken with care.
Paula: Yes.
Aunty Judith: And joys, you know, my joy was being in Grenada with you guys, you know, all the young people. I’m sure, sure you remember all of us having so much fun there.
Paula: Yes.
Aunty Judith: My three sons, and then having Matthew Gino family.
Paula: Mmm-hmm.
Aunty Judith: That for me were [00:26:00] wonderful days. Going fishing off the Point Saline.
Paula: True Blue, I think?
Aunty Judith: True Blue. And, the mango trees that were in the yard and the church across the road, Bethel. It was a full life.
Paula: It really was. And now, Judith, I have to say, you helped make it full. You brought a lot of joy to us.
Aunty Judith: Thank you.
Paula: A lot of our memories are associated with joy, associated with you because you’re always there to cheer us up, to be a happy smiling face in times that weren’t so good.
Aunty Judith: One thing I learned and this is a life lesson is that as you move from place to place, you have to decide to make the place your at home.
Paula: Yes.
Aunty Judith: And so that was me making Grenada my home [00:27:00] having moved from Jamaica there as a stranger, just as we have moved to the United States and now we’re making it home.
Paula: Exactly. And so this poem was joy. That’s the page, the one on page twenty nine, I assume.
Aunty Judith: Joy, twenty nine, let’s look at it. You wanna read it?
Paula: Yes, it is. What is joy? Lord, just a sweet breath that fills my head with hope or a melody in my heart that lifts my feet, yearning realized. Like a butterfly touches a bright flower. What is joy? Lord, just a mocking bird singing every song she knows on a perfect fall afternoon fanned by cool leaves. Yet another clear stream, seen in different light, revealing surface sky, deep weaving [00:28:00] grass, and boogie woogie fishes. What is joy? It is joy. Lord, thus a cry of a newborn, stilled by mother’s milk, or someone’s unexpected smile of welcome after a weary day. Your dog’s eyes telling you how special you are, no matter what, I can relate to that. Yet even these, dear one, are fleeting joy, glimpses only of the constant and eternal joy. Help me, Lord, to learn, inhale, inspire, hold my breath forever full of joy.
Aunty Judith: Yes. The boogie woogie fishes, I was looking at a pond and the pond was reflecting the sky, but also you could look through the water and see the fishes and there were goldfishes with [00:29:00] these very fancy tails and they were dancing. Yes, so.
Paula: I like your description. I would never have used that description for fish, you know, that are kind of almost, swimming very fast movement through the water, but this was a very apt description, and I thought, lovely, and Aunt Judith captured that. You did a fantastic job.
Aunty Judith: Thank you. I have a picture that I drew of my mom, a painting on page 29, and there’s a poem about that picture.
Paula: Oh.
Aunty Judith: Talk with David on meaning.
Paula: Okay.
Aunty Judith: Meaning of names. Which is on page 28.
Paula: Yes, I see it.
Aunty Judith: Talking to a pastor some years ago, he tickled my imagination saying, we live up to the meaning of our [00:30:00] names, even if not consciously aware of that meaning. Something inside us drives us to do. That is when I started to realize how much praise… that’s what my name means to me. And I try to share it more. My dear son’s names are Robert, bright fame, Andrew, manly, Ian, God is gracious. So I know that is true. My sister, Pam, honey has always been so. My brother, Dave, friend. My mother, Esmeralda, emerald has the most beautiful eyes. There’s a lot in a name. She had a kind of greenish tinge in her eyes.
Paula: She did! And her eyes were kind, you know, but when you saw her, you were, you were taken aback with, whoo, her eyes.
Aunty Judith: [00:31:00] Yes.
Paula: Full of life.
Aunty Judith: She was a force to be reckoned with.
Paula: Full of life, yes. So what inspired you to put all of these poems together in this book though? Because
Aunty Judith: I have been writing them over many years.
Paula: Mm-Hmm. .
Aunty Judith: And I said at first, before my first book, that none of my poems would ever be published. They were just for me. But my mom encouraged me. She had published books of poetry before, and she encouraged me. But it was only after she died that I actually got the courage, the gumption, to publish Jimbilin, self publish it. And then this one, having published Jimbilin, I just kept writing, and I discovered I had a lot of poems. So I thought, why not? But I did [00:32:00] want to make it. a combination of poems and paintings.
Paula: And stories. You had stories. You have stories.
Aunty Judith: And then the stories came in at the end when I went to Jamaica. These stories were written when I was on the beach in Jamaica, just for fun.
Paula: Ah,
Aunty Judith: yes, yes.
Paula: So they’re fiction or they’re based, I mean, they’re real life stories, but you. You…
Aunty Judith: Funny you should ask that.
Paula: Creativity?
Aunty Judith: They are fiction, but in there, there’s the background of relating to real life events and people, including myself.
Paula: Okay.
Aunty Judith: Yeah, so it’s kind of tongue in cheek. Some of the stuff.
Paula: Okay. Okay. All right. You said there’s another one that you wanted to talk about another poem.
Aunty Judith: Oh, I wanted to read Andrew’s poem. Mother’s Day. I never [00:33:00] forget my son, Andrew.
Paula: Yes,
At
Aunty Judith: 18, he went to glory.
Paula: Yes,
Aunty Judith: but he’s always remembered
Paula: always can never be forgotten. I mean,
Aunty Judith: Never forgotten.
Paula: Yes.
Aunty Judith: And people who have died, stay with us in our hearts.
Paula: Yes. That’s true.
Aunty Judith: So I have a picture of him there. He was so handsome.
Paula: Very handsome.
Aunty Judith: After he died, so many young women came weeping because they loved Andrew so much. Andrew’s birthday celebration, his birthday is March 29th, if you remember. Andrew, my son, so handsome and tall, outrageous in mirth, often ready to brawl. Yet very kind and generous in heart. Friend to so many, in you it [00:34:00] was an art. I watched you say yes to welcome Melody’s baby sibling. Even though you were dealing with pain and tube feeding, that mindless, aggressive cancer that congested your frame stopped your breath, but could not put out the flame of bright memories shining from many years past or the glory that you rushed ahead of us to meet. Because at the end, he said, don’t hold me back. He wanted to rush to something. And that was Robert experience that I got there late. Robert was there when he passed. Yeah.
Paula: Andrew said something to me that I’ve never forgotten because when he was [00:35:00] diagnosed, excuse me, I remember calling him and speaking with him and praying with him. And he said, you know what, no matter what happens, I am healed. If God chooses to heal me on this side of eternity, then I’m healed. But if he doesn’t, and I go, I pass on, I’m healed as well. I have never forgotten that.
Aunty Judith: Wow. That’s awesome.
Paula: Yes. I remember because I was speaking to him from my car and I know exactly where I was. I was parked talking with him. I was praying with him and he said, no matter what, I am healed. If I go on to eternity, I won’t have this cancer anymore. I’m healed. I’ve held on to that for years.
Aunty Judith: Yes, indeed. So, we were joking, Ian and I, about Mother’s Day, I said, maybe Andrew’s up there in heaven [00:36:00] now playing pan with this uncle Evelyn. No harp for him. Yeah, probably playing a pan.
Paula: Yes. Whoo, life.
Aunty Judith: Yes, life and death and we live in both, you know, it’s a fluid thing. Most people are afraid to think of death. I am sometimes, but it’s everybody’s destination.
Paula: That’s one thing that we know is going to happen no matter what.
Aunty Judith: Right. And so we come to terms with it in our own way. There’s a poem I wrote and I was pretending that there was this very fearful little old lady.
Paula: I read that one too.
Aunty Judith: Probably it was me and her courageous friend.
Paula: I’m looking for it.
Aunty Judith: It’s page [00:37:00] 72.
Paula: Page 72. Okay.
Aunty Judith: If you want to read it.
Paula: Let me see. Oops, I’m still trying to find it. My Greatest Fear. Yes. I can, Aunt Judith, why don’t you read it?
Aunty Judith: Okay, My Greatest Fear. My greatest fear is to die alone. My family is so far away, she whispered, lips quivering. I caught her tender, wrinkled face. Wiped away the tears, held her hand, then finally I ventured a reply. Don’t be afraid, my dear, dear friend. So many of us live solitary lives, yet I trust God. That no one ever passes alone. Eyes open and you see departed relatives come silently [00:38:00] surround you lovingly, gently shroud dark corners where terrors may try to linger a foretaste of heaven invigorates impels you to shed earthly concerns, urges you to rush towards the light. Hearing the last to go, they say, perhaps mystically transcends with you, basking in angelic music, sublime symphony.
Paula: Beautiful.
Aunty Judith: That’s a hope.
Paula: That’s a hope.
Aunty Judith: Yes.
Paula: Beautiful. What made you write this?
Aunty Judith: I know of so many people who live alone, not only live alone, but die alone. And some of them, some of the stories are really sad, you know, they’re discovered days later, that kind of thing. But I [00:39:00] saw a film which spoke about near death experiences. And in every case, there was a sense of this feeling of peace. And many spoke about a light, seeing a light. So I do believe that the process of death is sort of like birth. It’s a new birth into a new dimension.
Paula: I like that. Never thought about it that way, but yes,
Aunty Judith: Mmmm-hmmm.
Paula: Birth into a new dimension. Yeah.
Aunty Judith: And some of the things we associate in terms of rules with this. I think God just wipes those out. I think God’s grace is enough to blot out a lot of what we would say, you know, they weren’t saved. [00:40:00] They weren’t whatever. I just trust that God welcomes us.
Paula: We see that, and you mentioned that in one of your poems. We see that with Jesus’s life. You know how he didn’t condemn the woman caught in adultery? He said, go and sin no more, because the people who were condemning her were sinners as well.
Aunty Judith: Exactly. Exactly. Jesus. The only sinless one didn’t condemn her.
Paula: Didn’t condemn her. He just… I’ve thought about that so many times, you know, when you’re talking to people who are beating themselves up and, you know, not realizing that. Wait a minute. Everybody is sinful. Only Jesus didn’t sin. And let’s see how he dealt with people who were sinning. That was in sinful acts. The woman at the well, he didn’t need to talk to her because in those days, he didn’t talk to a woman. [00:41:00] But he talked to her. So the message we get…
Aunty Judith: He talked to her. He offered her hope.
Paula: Yes. Yes.
Aunty Judith: In a meaningful way.
Paula: In a meaningful, and he changed her life. Because she left there and ran into the town to tell people, You have to see this man. He told me everything about my life. But it didn’t condemn her.
Aunty Judith: Exactly. And the town believed. She became a missionary.
Paula: Yes. Yes. And that’s what God does for us. That’s what Jesus does for us. Every circumstance that we find ourselves in is never wasted. And if we see it like that, you know, this is an opportunity to change someone’s life, influence someone in a positive way, even the bad things that happened in our lives.
Aunty Judith: Exactly. If there were no bad things happening, you [00:42:00] would live a very, you would never have a challenge. You would never grow I suppose is the word.
Paula: So I also believe you want to appreciate how will you appreciate the good things if you’ve never had anything bad.
Aunty Judith: Exactly. Yeah. Mm hmm.
Paula: So, yeah. Yeah. So, as we’re trying, I mean, this has been an incredible session, reading these beautiful poems, all created, generated, inspired by God through my aunt. I want to ask you one, before we close, to just give us one tip. For, you know, as I said at the beginning, you have always been an aunt who I associate with joy and with happiness, and I know your life hasn’t been perfect, but in spite of that, you still generate joy. That’s why whenever I come to Orlando, I have to come and see [00:43:00] you.
Is there one tip that you can give to us? Because, you know, at your preface, you said something, which I stood out for me. You said, let me read it here. At 80, yes, a new book. 80 something is a good enough age to reflect on a life that has been, that has included hiding emotionally, many struggles for self realization, and finally, increasing self love and acceptance. Is there one tip you can leave with us?
Aunty Judith: I remember Jesus said repeatedly, Fear, not. That was his major message. Fear, not. And fear drives so much that happens in today’s society. You know, a lot of prejudice is based on fear. People don’t seek job opportunities out of fear. They [00:44:00] stay in their little rut and they’re unhappy. I think we just need to listen to Jesus. Fear not. A diagnosis comes, fear not. So that would be what I would encourage people to remember. Life is full of surprises.
Paula: Life is indeed full of surprises and so if you approach it not being fearful, that takes away some of the already difficulties that just life, just being in this world presents to us. I thank you for that, Grace. Fear not.
Aunty Judith: Thank you for having me.
Paula: So, one last question. If anyone wants to contact you, how can they contact you?
Aunty Judith: They can contact me through my email, which is my name, judith. [00:45:00] bullen@gmail.com. That may be the easiest way.
Paula: Okay. And you do have a website if I remember.
Aunty Judith: I do have a website too, but I can’t remember it right now.
Paula: Okay, I’ll put it in the show notes there because I think it’s
Aunty Judith: judithbullen.bigcartel.com.
Paula: Yes. I’ll put that in the show notes. And for those of you, my listeners and my viewers, if you do want to be a guest on my show, please reach out to me on my website, which is chattingwiththeexperts. com. Or you can get in touch with me on LinkedIn. Just search for Paula Okonneh. I’m also on Instagram. My handle there is chat_experts_podcast and Facebook is not quite my thing, but I’m trying. If you search for Paula Okonneh, you’ll find me there. Thank you.
Aunty Judith: Thank you.
Paula: This has been [00:46:00] so good. I’m sorry, you were saying something.
Aunty Judith: No, this was a pleasure.
Paula: What a pleasure it was to have my very own auntie. Yay.
Aunty Judith: Thank you.